Location, location, location

Posted by Lewis on August 31, 2004

In Reply to: A preference posted by ACME on August 31, 2004

: : : : : : I am a reference librarian and was asked to help someone find the origin of the phrase, "Put another notch in your belt". I can't find anything on it in dictionaries, encyclopedias, or on the Internet.

: : : : : : Any ideas?

: : : : : : Thanks!

: : : : : Notch in your belt sounds like something you would suggest to a successful dieter. Notch in your gun is more like it ... talks about the practice in the old west of putting a notch with your bowie knife in the stock of your gun for every man you killed.
: : : : : Very successful lotharios have been known to put a notch on the bedpost for every conquest, as well.

: : : : I've looked high and low in most of my references including a cowboy phrase book. I found nothing for: notch, another notch in your belt, another notch in your gun, another notch in your gun belt.

: : : : But I did find this online at what looks to be a Scouting site. Simon Kenton and Daniel Boone, as you probably know, were frontiersmen/Indian fighters.

: : : : Tally Gun Honors
: : : : By Dan Beard
: : : : www.inquiry.net/advancement/tally_gun.htm Accessed August 30, 2004.

: : : : Fig. 33:
: : : : Tally-gun
: : : : The tally-gun is a wooden-gun or any unloaded musket, rifle, or shot-gun which can be procured. This gun hangs upon the wall of the meeting-room, or "Fort," and is only taken down by Simon Kenton during meetings, and always saluted by the boys rising to their feet and giving the Daniel Boone cheer, after which it is again replaced upon its hooks on the wall. Whenever an official notch is won by the Fort, Simon Kenton, in the presence of the whole Fort, takes the gun from its rack, and when Daniel Boone gives the word Simon cuts a notch in the stock of the tally-gun with solemn ceremonies. Then it is again replaced upon the wall.

: : : : The diagram, Fig. 33, shows you a pattern from which you can draw a tally-gun on a piece of paper about two feet long. This is to hang upon the wall of your club-room or Fort Whenever a member of your Fort or the Fort itself wins a notch, paste a seal made of red paper on the gun paper, as shown in Fig. 33. Put one ribbon to the seal for a notch, two ribbons to the seal for a top-notch, and three ribbons to the seal of the honor top-notches, a description of which will follow.

: : : : You boys all know that it was the custom among the old pioneers whenever they took a scalp to cut a notch in the stock of their gun to commemorate the deed. In these days, however, we do not celebrate the taking of life or other acts of savagery. We will, however, keep the custom of cutting the notches, but our notches all stand for commendable deeds. Any boy who does an expert deed in woodcraft, athletics, natural history, forestry, or receives special commendation at school, may be voted a nick by his Fort or club. Ten of these nicks will make a notch and ten notches will make a top-notch.

: : : : (More about Simon Kenton at frontierfolk.org/ kenton.htm )

: : : A notch is a tally-mark for counting something. It is also a step or level ("moved up a notch" etc.). E.g., putting a notch in one's gun refers to recording another victory with the gun (another man shot down or killed, generally) according to Wild West folklore.

: : : Putting a notch in one's belt means recording a victory or achievement. This usage has existed for at least 75 years, maybe more. The notch is easy to understand, but why is it in a belt? I can only conjecture that this is from confusion or conflation with expressions such as "take [up] another notch in one's belt" or "take one's belt in a notch" referring to tightening one's belt (moving by one hole), i.e., getting ready for action (cf. "suck in one's gut"), which has been around for at least about 90 years, maybe much more. Maybe there's a better explanation.

: :
: : I'm sure 'tallying' has come up before - it is the simple way to record debt repayment for the illiterate - the lender would have a 'tally-man' who would visit the debtor and record debt & repayment on two sticks - notching them both - the sticks should match up exactly on what had been paid and they were said to 'tally'.

: : I'm afraid that to 'put another notch in the belt' usually refers to making another hole to accommodate a bigger gut - extra notches can be made either way from the initial series of holes. Much less likely for people to become slimmer as they acquire age and experience.

: : the more common expression is to 'let your belt out a notch' - meaning to dine well and become bloated.

: : 'to make another notch on the gun/barrel' was the expression I've heard used about the wild west - in myth, even if not in truth.

: : 'another notch on his/her bedpost' was the less violent analogy.

: I like the notch on the bedpost one best. Only one that would beat that is the notch on the convertible steering wheel.

Surely the dash or glove compartment would be more fitting?

She IS doing the driving, after all.