Grave error

Posted by Lewis on May 21, 2004

In Reply to: The Grave - 9 yards posted by Roger Regent on May 21, 2004

: : : : : : : Try American Football: when a play results in a first down with the ball just inside the defensive team's 10 yard line, then the offensive side cannot gain another set of downs. So, they have to go the whole 9 yards.

: : : : : : : : : : DOES ANYONE KNOW THE AMOUNT OF EARTH REMOVED TO CREATE A GRAVE. IT WOULD SEEM TO BE CLOSE TO NINE CUBIC YARDS..3X3X3 FEET SQUARE. IT SEEMS THAT NO ONE HAS EVER SUGGESTED THIS AS A POSSIBLE MEANING. I'VE ALWAYS HAVE USED AND HAVE HEARD USED "HE BOUGHT THE WHOLE NINE YARDS AS MEANING SOMEONE HAS BEEN KILLED. HOW ABOUT IT?

: : : : : : : : : Isn't 3'x 3' x 3' one cubic yard?

: : : : : : : : Might not be adequate for a midget's grave.... but even if we go to 6 feet under, and 6 feet long, we're only to 4 cubic yards. Another speculation turned to dust, unto dust, unto dust.

: : : : : : I think we determined that the expression predates American football.

: : : : : I am Sooooo glad that somebody brought up the Whole Nine yards. No page without brass monkeys or 9 yards is allowed in the archive.

: : : : : I'm still betting on the ammo belt to win, but where is the proof?

: : : : As I'm sure I previously pointed out a double grave 6ftX6ftX6ft9inches buried two people side by side below the 6ft depth dictated by the church authorities in medieval England - this is the origin of the expression 'the whole nine yards'. This explanation pre-dates ammunition belts or any of the other outlandish candidates presented on this, and other, websites.

: : : The maths may work out - as it did for concrete mixers and clothiers (allegedly) BUT before asserting the certainty of your explanation, based upon some historic explanation being before a more modern origin - I suggest that you find some recorded use. IF 'the whole nine yards' has a mediaeval origin, then you can look at literature from Chaucer onwards seeking it in print and expect to find it somewhere. Nobody has cited a reference to the expression before modern times - if you know of one, please share it, otherwise keep your over-confidence to yourself - your theory, without evidence, is no better than the others. Please show us your evidence, not simply contrived sums.

: : I heard that the cubic volume of a megalith (standing stone) at Avebury (and the smaller ones at Stonehenge) is 9 cubic yards. They predate church double graves by 4,000 years, so I win!!!!
: : Thet MUST be the earliest origin.

: I have studied the megaliths at Avebury and the stones at Stonehenge together with other standing stones throughout Europe and have never found any that had a cubic capacity of exactly 9 cubic yards - even allowing for a reasonable amount of erosion over the years - nor, for that matter, are any of them 9 yards apart or 9 yards high. The 9 cubic yard grave has a strange ring of the possible about it for they were very particular about burial practices in medieval England and a search of parish records may yield some evidence. I doubt Chaucer has reference to it.

My earlier point is that surely, if the expression 'whole 9 yards' is not relatively recent, then with the extensive cannon of literature, it would have been referred to somewhere and whoever posited it being true should cite some authority, not assert that because the notion is old, it must be true. there were various rules about burial customs laid down by the church - but that makes it even more likely that there would be a reference.

Li Yar was extending that point to an even older spurious origin - oldest is only the best if there is some corroboration.